[Twisted-web] Re: [Twisted-Python] Fwd: [Twisted-commits] r11721 - revert r11685

James Y Knight foom at fuhm.net
Mon Sep 20 11:16:39 MDT 2004

I guess I'll keep the crossposting, since this may be of interest to 
those who do not read the twisted-web list.

On Sep 20, 2004, at 11:46 AM, Cory Dodt wrote:
> Urgh.  I usually avoid getting involved in these discussions--not 
> because I
> don't want to participate but because the ML style does not work very 
> well
> with my brain.  There's all these different parts of this proposal and 
> some
> are being rejected by some people and modified by other people and 
> it's very
> hard for me to figure out what the whole picture is.
> In this case, I have to say something because this is pretty important 
> to the
> product I'm developing.  I just spent 6 weeks doing a conversion to 
> Nevow
> because Woven isn't being supported any more.  I do *not* want to do 
> the same
> thing with Web.  I've made modifications to Twisted trunk that I was 
> hoping to
> get out of 2.0 for our official release, but if there's not going to 
> be a web1
> any more, that puts this project in jeopardy again because it means I 
> may not
> be able to use 2.0.

I do not want that to happen. Note foremost what web2 is. 1) A rewrite 
of the Request/low level HTTP layer. 2) *Migrating* the Nevow resource 
model back into the core webserver where it belongs.

Where there are conflicting statements by others, I'd go with what I 
say since so far I seem to be in charge of web2. ;)

In quick summary: since you've already migrated to Nevow, I expect to 
be able to provide easy compatibility with your app so you can use new 
releases of Nevow that depend on web2 with little work. If you 
currently have web1 resources working with Nevow, they will also work 
with Nevow/web2.

> So here's what I have to say: please *summarize*.  I need to get a 
> sense of:
> 1) Timeline.. when are changes being implemented, in what order, tied 
> to what
> release etc.

Web2 will be done when it is done, hopefully by the time Twisted 2.0 
releases, but if not, then not. In parallel with development of web2, a 
branch of the Nevow repository will be developed that uses t.web2. That 
should be released at the same time. Web1 will stay around for the 
indefinite future. SVN trunk of Nevow will remain dependent only upon 
web1 until such a time as web2&nevow-which-uses-it work sufficiently 
well at which point that branch will merge with the trunk.

> 2) How is the svn repo going to change?

Right now? t.web2 gets added to Twisted. Nevow gets a branch.

> 3) What is going to be put into what release by whom?

I don't know what you're asking.

> 4) What's the impact if you're currently using web1 and you want to be 
> using
> web2 because 1 isn't supported any more?

The migration from web1 to web2 will be about the same difficulty as 
the migration from web1 to Nevow.

However, you are currently not using (most of) web1, so that is the 
wrong question to ask. You are using Nevow's appserver, which is 
basically the same as what web2's appserver will be.

Web2 will be mostly compatible with current Nevow. I say mostly only 
because it may not be feasible to provide absolutely complete 
compatibility, but I'd like to provide compatibility for all the things 
that normal apps use (Nevow Resource API and app-facing parts of the 
Request object).

Web2 will be somewhat compatible with web1 Resources. "Somewhat" here 
means basically the same thing it already means with Nevow (since the 
code will be essentially the same code).

If you're using the Nevow "appserver" now, ideally you will not have to 
change your app for it to work with web2, although you may want to 
change some things to avoid deprecation warnings. Not everything always 
turns out ideally, so I can't promise that, but it is the goal.

> 5) What's the impact if you stay with web1?

You cannot use new releases of Nevow after <whenever web2 is done and 
the Nevow branch is merged>. Web1 will continue to have the same amount 
of maintenance as it does now (namely: almost none)


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