[Twisted-Python] Twisted O'Reilly Book

Sergio Trejo serj_trejo at hotmail.com
Mon Aug 2 21:45:26 MDT 2004


Thanks for some well thought ideas and comments. I'm vocal and I'm 
interested. And my gloves on the keyboard are busy such that my brain can 
grok as much of Twisted as possible. If only I could just plug into the 
Matrix and grok it all in one fell swoop! :-)  I'm learning atop lately, and 
then its on to nevow.

Maybe there's a nevow expert in the crowd (Mary Gardiner, aren't you a Nevow 
maestro?) who is willing to collaborate such that we can get the Twisted 
Foundation into motion along the lines of what Tim has suggested? Tim, would 
you be up for helping out in some form or another? Hey, I bet we could get 
some ideas and suggestions from Mitch Kapor's group since they are going to 
be using Twisted and would probably like to see its Declaration of 
Independence. Or maybe someone from Mozilla or Apache can give us some ideas 
of what to do and what not to do since they've been through the trials and 
tribulations of Foundation genesis.

Oh yes, and another thought -- what about the company Zoteca in New York 
City? Surely they would be interested in a Twisted Foundation, no?

One of the great things about having a Foundation is that it doesn't have to 
keep secrets. It is truly open and there are no hidden cards in the deck. At 
the same time, anyone is free to birth artificial persons in any territory 
on Earth who then can utilize the Foundation but also contribute back to it. 
This is why Twisted needs a Declaration of Independence IMHO. I see no 
reason why *not* to create a Twisted Foundation for the benefit of 

Imagine, a kid in Africa who has access to the 'Net who is learning computer 
science could participate in the Twisted Foundation and contribute something 
really cool, such as a new protocol, to the code base. Or some child in 
Thailand could use Twisted's Perspective Broker and Nevow to create some 
really neat 'net-based agriculture Web service for the farmers and hill 
tribe people in northeast agricultural Thailand (where Internet cafes 
continue to sprout up). And of course really cool apps and services could be 
created by the whiz gurus in the more modernized countries at the same time.

A Foundation is a self serving entity whose goal is to survive independent 
of any others who make use of it. A Foundation owes nothing to no one, and 
can not be held hostage by anyone. Foundations are good for humanity. 
Foundations have need not retain secrets. Foundations do not impose 
detriment on others. I can't imagine a world without Apache (yikes, we'd all 
be forced to using Microsoft's IIS Web Server).

Any further comments, ideas, brainstorms, suggestions?


>From: Tim Stebbing <tim.stebbing at nunatak.com.au>
>Reply-To: Twisted general discussion <twisted-python at twistedmatrix.com>
>To: Twisted general discussion <twisted-python at twistedmatrix.com>
>Subject: Re: [Twisted-Python] Twisted O'Reilly Book
>Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2004 19:29:19 +1000
>A Foundation is just that, a -foundation-, for building ontop of. Look at 
>the Mozilla foundation; they provide a base framework, and support a 
>multitude of applications built with it. Look at the apache foundation, 
>they are an edge case, but there we see a group of apps that are built 
>loosly around a theme, the apache web services.
>I guess the point I'm trying to make is that a Twisted foundation would 
>need the capacity to support this sort of community of related projects, 
>with the twisted framework as the basic premise for all projects.
>I personally think its a great idea, I have stuff I'd love to contribute 
>once finished, which do not make sense in terms of being added to the 
>twisted framework, in the same way divmod produce associated software, Im 
>sure alot of you do too.
>However I can't see any form of foundation framework (web based) or people 
>to manage it just appearing as if by magic, as Glyph said noone has the 
>time anymore.
>I think what is being asked for are bounties? If you have something you 
>would like to see implemented, rather than donate to a slush fund, offer a 
>bounty to the first person to deliver. Perhaps there could be a bounty 
>board? ie:
>who | what?                                      | how much?
>tjs | I'd like to see xml-rpc basic auth support | $300 USD *
>There is nothing stopping bounty and foundation ideas from going ahead, 
>other than time and energy.
>I imagine that reading this email, and the ones prior, there will be about 
>50+ people nodding their heads in agreement, and then thinking "It would be 
>great, but I'm not going to take the time to set that all up, I'm to busy"
>I also imagine, if someone was to take the time to think this through, 
>write up some nevow frontend for a twisted foundation and get it all going, 
>noone would object to having it hosted under the twisted banner.
>so to those of you most vocal on this topic, I suggest you stop 
>pontificating and get your hacking gloves on  :)
>* This is not an offer ;)
>(o_   Timothy Stebbing, Pythonista, Nunatak Systems
>//\    03 6226 6259, tim.stebbing at nunatak.com.au
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