[Twisted-Python] ldaptor feedback

Clark C. Evans cce at clarkevans.com
Wed Jul 2 12:30:40 EDT 2003

On Wed, Jul 02, 2003 at 05:28:38PM +0300, Tommi Virtanen wrote:
| On Wed, Jul 02, 2003 at 08:07:48AM +0000, Clark C. Evans wrote:
| > | 	LDAP is not really used commonly enough to bloat the twisted
| > | 	core with it. (Quick! Name three end user applications using
| > | 	LDAP!)
| > I think LDAP is pretty cornerstone to any internet application
| > where 'single sign on' and other directory information is 
| > required.   If it was available, I even picture game servers
| > or muds using it... 
| 	You mean you hope it will be? (Quick! Name three end user
| 	applications using LDAP!)

I'll name 3 common internet protocols which often in large
enterprises are hooked up to LDAP...


| 	LDAP is an ugly, broken, horrible non-unixy non-internetty
| 	protocol conceived by the folk who gave you such marvels as
| 	X.25. I hope LDAP dies screaming.

Well, I agree here.   But *something* has to fill this role of
orgnization wide directory.  Perhaps a unixy LDAP replacement is 
needed down stream.

| > After reading the RFC, it seems that "entry" is most often used
| > to mean an object in the LDAP database.
| 	I'm guessing you won't be happy even after an
| 	s/LDAPObject/LDAPEntry/g operation, so I'm not
| 	doing that right now.. It doesn't really matter
| 	what those classes are called, as you aren't
| 	supposed to really ever instantiate them yourself.

Well, I'd rather see ldap.Entry ... "entry" is far superior
to "object".   You don't call a tuple returned by the database
an "object", you call it a "row" (not an ODBCRow).  There 
really isn't a 1-1 correspondence between object and 
LDAP's entry.

| > Right.   And I'd just like to see the opposite:
| > 
| >         1.  state machine
| > 
| >              ldaptor.protocols.ldap3.client
| >              ldaptor.protocols.ldap3.server
| >       
| >         2. wire format
| > 
| >              ldaptor.protocols.ldap3.wire.ber
| >              ldaptor.protocols.ldap3.wire.request
| 	Pureber and pureldap should be applicable to all LDAP versions
| 	and LDAP over UDP. Pureber should be applicable to all BER-based
| 	protocols, such as SNMP. They have a broader scope than a
| 	single protocol.


| 	There's no way around it. For what is in the Twisted core,
| 	he wants to have freedoms the LGPL doesn't give him. I don't
| 	want to donate expected ~30000 lines of python away just
| 	like that; I want to make him be bound to LGPL, just like
| 	everyone else.

Assume for a moment that a foundation (similar to Apache) is
formed for Twisted.   What characteristics of this organization
are required for you to be 'comfortable' with the code being

| 	Let me repeat myself. If installing one library is too
| 	much effort for you, you are using the wrong OS.

I'd rather not have twisted require a package management
service to download all the third party components necessary.



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