[Twisted-Python] SURVEY: For Twisted users, please answer
glyph at twistedmatrix.com
Thu Apr 24 21:52:05 EDT 2003
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On Wednesday, April 23, 2003, at 12:54 AM, Moshe Zadka wrote:
> On Debian woody (stable), Python/GTK+ is available only for Python 2.1.
> This means woody users would not be able to use the GUI clients in
> (some of which are GTK+-based). In addition, other libraries which
> developers might wish to use might be unavailable for Python 2.2. I can
> probably conjure up a list of such libraries.
Python/GTK+ is only necessary for two arguably experimental portions of
Twisted - im and manhole. I think that it is acceptable to remove
support in Debian woody for these, considering that more substantial,
stable portions of Twisted (e.g. Conch, and twisted.web SSL) don't
work, since they require libraries that are missing on woody. Future
GTK+ work is going to be using GTK2 anyway, considering that it is
vastly more stable for the kinds of things we want to do, most of which
involve displaying large, scrolling blocks of text.
PyQT is technically in Debian, but the version in Woody isn't very
useful, and I haven't heard from anyone using it with Twisted.
There are no third-party programs that support Debian woody which
require GTK to be working with Twisted.
As to other libraries - my primary concern was with database drivers
which may have been incompatible with Python-2.2. However, it appears
that all DB-API compatible drivers that come with Woody have both
python-2.1 and python-2.2 versions.
I've just spent the last few weeks working without the 2.1-support
constraint, and I can see why all the Twisted developers have been
clamoring for 2.2 :-). While I have some concern that moving along
with rearrangements of Python's basic semantics encourages the
development of useless, whiz-bang infrastructure, the fact is that the
new object model is substantially more amenable to necessary features
like those implemented in twisted.python.components and
The results of this survey appear to indicate that most Twisted users
are not using Python-2.1, and those that are plan to stop in the near
future. Also, as far as I can tell, nobody on the development team
uses Python 2.1 any more, and so test failures related to 2.1
incompatibilities are always caught after the fact.
I think it would improve our development speed and the general attitude
of the team, so I propose we cut over to 2.2 immediately. For the
reasons I gave above, I don't think the GTK situation is important
enough to prevent this. If anyone else would like to give reasons for
not going ahead with this, please speak now or forever hold your peace
(This does not mean "everybody check in 2.2-only code". It means "get
ready to check in 2.2-only code". I will hopefully announce open
season on 2.2 features later this week.)
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